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Life well spent is long. ..."da Vinci (1452-1519, Italian artist, sculptor, painter, architect, engineer and scientist) "

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 Author Topic: Current Loop in magnetic field (How motor works!)  (Read 45559 times) 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Click to toggle author information(expand message area).
Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message on: February 01, 2009, 04:32:40 pm »

This simulation shows a current loop in uniform magnetic field.
The black arrows show the force due to magnetic field on the loop.
$\vec{F}= q \vec{v} \times \vec{B}$ or $\vec{F}= I \int d\vec{\ell} \times \vec{B}$
The magnetic field in in the +Z direction if Bz>0.
Then ,torque for the loop is calculated from definition $\vec{\tau}=\vec{r}\times\vec{F}$

Because the current flow in the same counter-clockwise direction.
The force on the loop change sign during each helf cycle.
If we current reverse direction during each helf cycle, the following device can turn into a motor.
A voltage source is needed in the loop to drive the current.
-*-

P.S. The above simulation did not include the induced emf due to changing magnetic field in the loop.

You are welcomed to check out a very good animation DC motor operation principle

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Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #1 on: February 01, 2009, 11:16:43 pm »

Registed user can get files related to this applet for offline access.
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If java program did not show up, please download and install latest Java RUN TIME

Here is the real motor:

In order to make motor reach stable rotational motion. A friction force is introduced: F=-constant *b*omage;//where b is the width in y-direction
Even thought magnitude of the magnetic force is the same (black arrows),
the torque is a function of cos(w*t)

If the process is reversed: A loop rotating in a uniform magnetic field will become electric power generator.
Please check out A loop rotating in a magnetic field (How electric power generator works!)

Registed user can get files related to this applet for offline access.
Problem viewing java?Add http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ to exception site list
If java program did not show up, please download and install latest Java RUN TIME

Embed a running copy of this simulation

Embed a running copy link(show simulation in a popuped window)
Full screen applet or Problem viewing java?Add http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ to exception site list
Press the Alt key and the left mouse button to drag the applet off the browser and onto the desktop. This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 2.5 Taiwan License
• Please feel free to post your ideas about how to use the simulation for better teaching and learning.
• Post questions to be asked to help students to think, to explore.
• Upload worksheets as attached files to share with more users.
Let's work together. We can help more users understand physics conceptually and enjoy the fun of learning physics!
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lookang
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http://weelookang.blogspot.com

 « Embed this message Reply #2 on: February 02, 2009, 07:58:33 am » posted from:SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE

This simulation shows a current loop in uniform magnetic field.The magnetic field in in the +Z direction if Bz>0.
1. Add vector field arrow(s) for vector Bz .

Because the current flow in the same counter-clockwise direction.

2. Add  arrow(s) line along the sides of the wires to aid visualization of I current and q current flow.
$\vec{F}= q \vec{v} \times \vec{B}$ or $\vec{F}= I \int d\vec{\ell} \times \vec{B}$

3. in the electron objects, can draw a negative sign -, to make it immediately association to electrons?

indeed  nice applets
can split posts into 2 separate applets for ease of discussion/collaboration etc.

thanks!
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Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #3 on: February 02, 2009, 09:59:13 am »

I modified it according to your suggestion. However, I did not draw negative sign, because there are too many symbol shown already.
More checkboxs are added for user to decide which symbols s/he did not need! (velocity/field/force)
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #4 on: October 23, 2009, 12:36:18 pm » posted from:SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE

i found these applets that can be referred to for improving the Ejs applet above.

http://www.magnet.fsu.edu/education/tutorials/java/dcmotor/index.html

http://www.walter-fendt.de/ph11e/electricmotor.htm

i try to remix from your applets, i will learn a lot from remixing.

will ask again for help
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #5 on: October 29, 2009, 01:45:34 pm » posted from:SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE

i am done remixing Ejs Open Source DC Motor Model by Fu-Kwun Hwang and lookang
http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ntnujava/index.php?topic=1266
enjoy and thanks again Prof Hwang!

http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ntnujava/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1266.0;attach=1432;image[/img]]http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ntnujava/index.php?topic=1266
 « Last Edit: October 29, 2009, 01:47:17 pm by lookang » Logged
lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #6 on: December 12, 2009, 12:26:45 am » posted from:Singapore,,Singapore

Hi prof hwang,
found the second applet not loading like i encountered before.
load: class users.ntnu.fkh.currentloopinbmotor_pkg.currentloopinbmotorApplet.class not found.
java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: users.ntnu.fkh.currentloopinbmotor_pkg.currentloopinbmotorApplet.class
at sun.plugin2.applet.Applet2ClassLoader.findClass(Unknown Source)
at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass(Unknown Source)
at java.lang.ClassLoader.loadClass(Unknown Source)
at sun.plugin2.applet.Plugin2ClassLoader.loadCode(Unknown Source)
at sun.plugin2.applet.Plugin2Manager.createApplet(Unknown Source)
at sun.plugin2.applet.Plugin2Manager$AppletExecutionRunnable.run(Unknown Source) at java.lang.Thread.run(Unknown Source) Caused by: java.io.IOException: open HTTP connection failed:http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ntnujava/ejs4/users/ntnu/fkh/currentloopinbmotor_pkg/currentloopinbmotorApplet/class.class at sun.plugin2.applet.Applet2ClassLoader.getBytes(Unknown Source) at sun.plugin2.applet.Applet2ClassLoader.access$000(Unknown Source)
at sun.plugin2.applet.Applet2ClassLoader\$1.run(Unknown Source)
at java.security.AccessController.doPrivileged(Native Method)
... 7 more
Exception: java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: users.ntnu.fkh.currentloopinbmotor_pkg.currentloopinbmotorApplet.class
Reading certificates from 11 http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ntnujava/ejsuser/14019/ejs_DCmotor.jar | C:\Users\160\AppData\LocalLow\Sun\Java\Deployment\cache\6.0\21\48384655-45e7ddf6.idx
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Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #7 on: December 12, 2009, 09:41:27 am » posted from:Taipei,T\'ai-pei,Taiwan

Thank you! It is fixed now.
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macfamous
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 « Embed this message Reply #8 on: February 26, 2010, 01:11:08 am » posted from:Yogyakarta,Yogyakarta,Indonesia

Sorry but I still get a little problem here .. may we have just a simple formula for this .. -*-
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Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #9 on: February 26, 2010, 11:03:49 am » posted from:Taipei,T\'ai-pei,Taiwan

The fomula for force and torque are provided in the previous posts.
May I know what kind of formula are you looking for?
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #10 on: April 15, 2011, 10:32:32 am » posted from:SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE

Here is the real motor:

In order to make motor reach stable rotational motion. A friction force is introduced: F=-constant *b*omage;//where b is the width in y-direction
Even thought magnitude of the magnetic force is the same (black arrows),
the torque is a function of cos(w*t)

<applet code="users.ntnu.fkh.currentloopinbmotor_pkg.currentloopinbmotorApplet.class" codebase="/ntnujava/ejs4/" archive="ejs_currentloopinbmotor.jar" name="currentloopinbmotor" id="currentloopinbmotor" width="626" height="628"></applet>

If the process is reversed: A loop rotating in a uniform magnetic field will become electric power generator.
Please check out A loop rotating in a magnetic field (How electric power generator works!)

Hi Prof!
i think i found a small bug that did not affect the simulation model because the inertia in your sim is always 1

the logic is
if
dcta/dt = omega

domega/dt = (getAlpha(cta) -bf*omega)/Inertia

because (getAlpha(cta) -bf*omega) = resultant torque

so magnetic torque = getAlpha(cta)
and magnetic force is F= N*I*L*B*sign2;

the a2 is actual the a2=N*I*L*B*b; (in my DC sim Ejs Open Source DC Motor Model by Fu-Kwun Hwang and lookang http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ntnujava/index.php?topic=1266) instead of a2=I*L*B*b/Inertia (in your current DC sim http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ntnujava/index.php?topic=912.msg3432#msg3432;
ignore my N because i have modified the sim into a multi turns DC motor.

is my interpretation of the physics DC model correct?
thanks!

In other words,
your model should be like this
dcta/dt = omega
domega/dt = (getAlpha(cta) -bf*omega)/Inertia
where a2=I*L*B*b; for your case, since your (or our) a2 is the torque*length b
need to modify code at 2 places.
 « Last Edit: April 15, 2011, 10:40:06 am by lookang » Logged
Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #11 on: April 16, 2011, 09:19:33 am » posted from:Taipei,T'ai-pei,Taiwan

It is corrected!
I was tring to calculate torque and angular velocity.
However, it was displayed as force and velocity.
Thank you!
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Life well spent is long. ..."da Vinci (1452-1519, Italian artist, sculptor, painter, architect, engineer and scientist) "
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