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 Author Topic: Electric field structure and Field lines for two point charges +/-  (Read 31798 times) 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Click to toggle author information(expand message area).
Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message on: October 01, 2007, 11:53:48 pm »

You can drag either charge and find out the new electric distribution.
-*-

The field line are calculated in real time. However, please remember field line is not the same as trajectory for a test charge move in the same field.
You can add test charge if the check box were checked and watch the trajectory of test charge.

It is easy to draw those vectors which represent electric field at different positions.
Because we can calculate the electric field with $\vec{E}=\frac{kq_1}{r_1^2}\hat{r_1}+ \frac{kq_2}{r_2^2}\hat{r_2}$.
However, do you know how those field lines were calculated?

Hint: The tangential components of electric field line is the same as the firection of electric field at the same point.

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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #1 on: November 11, 2008, 03:26:02 pm » posted from:SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE

there is a similar physics applet here
http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ntnujava/index.php?topic=730.msg2703#msg2703
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KezzaH
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 « Embed this message Reply #2 on: June 02, 2009, 12:35:15 am » posted from:Sydney,New South Wales,Australia

It would be a great improvement if you could vary the charge on the particles in size and from positive to negative
Kind Regards
Kerry H
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #3 on: June 02, 2009, 08:37:40 am » posted from:,,Singapore

http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/ntnujava/index.php?topic=736.0

Electric Field Applet PhysletsÂ®, Wolfgang Christian.

I do a add + and reposition the charges to create the effects of more than one.
 Electric Field Applet PhysletsÂ®, Wolfgang Christian..PNG (17.59 KB, 643x444 - viewed 946 times.) Logged
Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #4 on: June 02, 2009, 10:28:45 am » posted from:Taipei,T'ai-pei,Taiwan

It would be a great improvement if you could vary the charge on the particles in size and from positive to negative
Kind Regards
Kerry H

The applets has been updated with the options you want. I also added option for equal-potential contours.
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #5 on: June 02, 2009, 05:27:47 pm » posted from:Singapore,,Singapore

Can make it almost like the physlets charge applet? I wish to study how to do it.

I don't think i can figure out this one, simply too advance for me to redo in Ejs.

May i request more comments line to help others like me understand and learn how to model it in Ejs. Thanks!
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Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #6 on: June 02, 2009, 07:37:27 pm » posted from:Taipei,T\'ai-pei,Taiwan

Quote
Can make it almost like the physlets charge applet?
What other features you want to add to the above applet?

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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #7 on: September 30, 2010, 09:41:49 pm »

awesome!
the applet has been updated with physlet style function.
will look at it asap.
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #8 on: October 05, 2010, 10:54:39 am » posted from:SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE

i been looking at the codes
i have a question
i notice the test mass uses

evolution to move
dvxc/dt = -getF(-1,xc,yc,0)/m
dvyc/dt= -getF(-1,xc,yc,1)/m

where getF
double dx1,dy1,dx2,dy2,r12,r22,dx,dy,d,sign=-1;
public double getF (int i, double xi,double yi, int mode) {//return electric field
if(count>=n)return 0; // count >=n , do ntg
dx1=xi-x1; dy1=yi-y1;
dx2=xi-x2; dy2=yi-y2;
r12=dx1*dx1+dy1*dy1; r22=dx2*dx2+dy2*dy2;
if(i>-1){
// if( (x>xmax && (y-ymax)*(y-ymin)>0) || (x<xmin && (y-ymax)*(y-ymin)>0) || //(y>ymax && (x-xmax)*(x-xmin)>0) || (y<ymin && (x-xmax)*(x-xmin)>0) ||
if(xi>scale*xmax || yi>scale*ymax || xi<scale*xmin || yi<scale*ymin || r12<size22 || r22<size22) {
out=true;// if electric field line move outside the drawing region too far=> do not need to following the field line any more
count++;
return 0.;
}
}
if(i<np)sign=q1/Math.abs(q1); // question sign mean sign of q1 ?
else sign=q2/Math.abs(q2); // // question sign mean sign of q2 ?
dx=q1*dx1/(r12*Math.sqrt(r12))+q2*dx2/(r22*Math.sqrt(r22));
dy=q1*dy1/(r12*Math.sqrt(r12))+q2*dy2/(r22*Math.sqrt(r22));
d=Math.sqrt(dx*dx+dy*dy);
if(mode==0)return sign*dx/d; // question what does mode do?
else return sign*dy/d;
}

My thoughts:
i tested the codes in the applet, i change the
Q1 = + or -
Q2 = 0
and the test particles goes in the out of the view direction regardless of the signs of Q1.
it is a bug or i need to modify the codes more to reflect the sign of Q1 and Q2?
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #9 on: October 06, 2010, 09:14:14 am » posted from:SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE

i suspect the original codes for the motion of the test mass is incorrectly modeled.

assumption:
test charge by default is positive,

condition:
When both q1 and q2 are negative,

result:
the path of the test charge defy the electric field vectors direction.

request:
chance to update the codes to reflect the physics of force correctly on the motion of the test charge?

can you made it on a separate page say {Force} so that i can track the changes made. i been editing on the current version of your applet

My thoughts:
i been trying to categorize the codes into
{Field Lines} {Field Vectors} {Potential} for ease of open source sharing of codes!

thanks!

in case you are wondering, my source code is attached
 bugtestcharge.PNG (69.97 KB, 775x644 - viewed 669 times.) *** There are 1 more attached files. You need to login to acces it! « Last Edit: October 06, 2010, 09:22:29 am by lookang » Logged
Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #10 on: October 06, 2010, 04:48:47 pm » posted from:,,Taiwan

Thank you for the bug report. I modified the code and it is updated.
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #11 on: October 07, 2010, 05:13:44 pm » posted from:SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE,SINGAPORE

fantastic!

thanks for update.

Can i request for another feature in your applet?
arrows at the mid of charges to edge of applet to be position at midpoint and the direction of arrow is at direction of field lines at the mid point?

the pedagogy reason is field lines are normally drawn with some indication of the direction.
chance to help

 requestcharge.PNG (58.27 KB, 1130x606 - viewed 2072 times.) Logged
Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #12 on: October 07, 2010, 09:36:27 pm » posted from:,,Taiwan

Right now the arrows are draw as 20x20 matrix.
Do you mean you want it to be draw as 21x21 matrix (Then the middle one is the the center of the drawingPanel)?
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #13 on: October 08, 2010, 11:04:25 pm » posted from:Singapore,,Singapore

the picture says it all.
i can't make sense of the variables controlling the field lines so cannot do it myself

when i can make sense of the codes, by observing the changes you made, i will learn more
thanks!
 « Last Edit: October 08, 2010, 11:06:38 pm by lookang » Logged
Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #14 on: October 08, 2010, 11:22:14 pm » posted from:,,Taiwan

I think I know what you want now. It has been updated!
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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #15 on: October 09, 2010, 04:24:27 pm » posted from:Singapore,,Singapore

.
it didn't look updated.

did you check it? see my picture
 bug.png (31.54 KB, 763x599 - viewed 626 times.) Logged
Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #16 on: October 09, 2010, 06:23:31 pm » posted from:,,Taiwan

I thought you were talking about the vector field. I changed it so that it re-present direction for the point at the center of of arrow  (instead of the starting point).

Now. I finally understand you want to add arrow for field lines.

It is updated!

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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #17 on: October 09, 2010, 07:27:43 pm » posted from:Singapore,,Singapore

the file invalid or corrupt ?

the file size is too small and the web do not deploy
 invalid.png (10.28 KB, 616x153 - viewed 623 times.) Logged
Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #18 on: October 09, 2010, 09:20:59 pm » posted from:,,Taiwan

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lookang
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 « Embed this message Reply #19 on: October 09, 2010, 10:09:00 pm » posted from:Singapore,,Singapore

that is what i wanted!

the codes looks like different and amazingly difficult.
fx and fy
will study it soonest!
thanks!

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Fu-Kwun Hwang
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 « Embed this message Reply #20 on: October 09, 2010, 10:37:18 pm » posted from:,,Taiwan

Because you asl for arrow for each field line, so fx,fy arrays are coordinnate where the arrow are drawn. fdx,fdy are vector for the arrow.
Code are added to find fx,fy, fdx and fdy.
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There is a better way to do it; find it. ..."Thomas Edison(1847-1931, American inventor, 1093 patients)"